Other Guys as nuts as me

Greg, 
   I don't have any pictures of my current project yet but thought you might get a chuckle out of the inclosed.  I had to scan them on another computer, thus the strange name and address.  In 1971 I lived in Indiana and was racing 6 cylinder dirt track cars.  I had been reading about turbos in Hot Rod and ran across a guy who had built a complete draw-thru system for a 292 Chevy six.  His tech guys had figured out what it was so he had to remove it.  I bought the whole thing for $50. 
  By 1973 I was living in Louisiana and built the 6-cylinder modified (picture enclosed).  After I had built my usual racing engine, I decided to hang my turbo system on the side.  The engine picture was taken the day I first fired it.  The next picture was taken after it was painted and I was on my way to its first race. 
   I raced 3 times and had 3 blown head gaskets.  I then removed it in disgust and did not try it again until 1988 when I put it on my current project, which at the time was a completely stock 54 Chev pickup with a 235.  I learned two lessons from the installation on the dirt car. First, it did not like high compression.   Second, it did not like a racing cam. The carb is a Holley 500 CFM 2-bbl, which I was running on the car without the turbo.  I since found that my 650 2-bbl was not too much for the stock 235.   The engine was a 250 Chev, by the way.  You prabably can't see from the engine picture, but I had a copper tube coiled around the intake pipe through which I pumped ice water.(Early intercooler?)  I also had a cool can in which I packed ice.  Two more lessons--ice lasts about 2 minutes on a hot, muggy Louisiana night.  Anyway, I hope you enjoy my folly. 
Roland 

Car Motor



 

Greg,
You may remember that I wrote to you about my turbo 235 Chev six
project. I am going to send you several pictures-- not for your web site
but just for your amusement. I inverted the intake/exhaust manifold
combination and mounted my turbo directly on the exhaust flange, which now
faces up. I thought it would be an advantage from the standpoint of
minimum heat loss. I made my airbox out of a Hamilton Beach mixing
bowl(stainless steel) that is the perfect size to weld to my air cleaner
base for mounting on my carburetor. I have welded on a pipe and fitted a
radiator cap(13 lbs) to act as a blow off valve. I am now rigging a bypass
valve that will divert some compressed air back to the air cleaner when I
go from high boost to high vacuum. I think I may have a problem with my
carb mount in that the mixture must make a u-turn since the outlet flange
now faces downward. I am afraid that I will get some fuel puddling at the
bottom of the u. If that does turn out to be a problem, I am going to cut
a hole in the side of the manifold for the intake so no u-turn is required.
I think the big advantage over the blow-thru system and my old draw system
(which is a hell of a lot simpler) is the ability to use an intercooler. I
am mounting a Buick Grand National intercooler right in front of the
radiator. I am not sure how much I am going to have to trim the back of
the grille for this. I am not too worried since my background is in
building modified stock cars not street rods. The credo for those guys is
take a torch to it if it doesn't fit! Anyway, I thought I would send you a
bit of an update on my project since you were so kind to share yours. I am
currently concentrating on modifying my carburetor and fuel delivery
system. Gotta go--take care.
Roland 

 Greg,

   Several months ago I told you I would send some pictures of my '54 Chevy while being changed from a draw-thru to a blow-thru.  Everything is taking much longer than expected, which, of course, is how it always goes.  I am now using a Porsche 930 turbo and an intercooler from a Buick Grand National.  The manifolds are mounted upside down with the turbo mounted directly on the exhaust manifold with a bolt on adapter.  The carb bonnet is a Hamilton Beach mixing bowl sitting on a Holley 650 high performance 2 barrel.  The short block is high mileage, stone stock.  The head is ported with oversize intake and exhaust valves.  I have a Holley blue fuel pump and a Holley high pressure fuel pressure regulator.  I have a homemade water and alcohol injector (dribbler)--that's the blue tank on the fender panel.  It also has a homemade mister aimed at the intercooler to increase heat transfer under boost.  I also installed an HEI ignition from a late model Chevy 250.  That's about it.  How will it run?  I have no clue.  I was extremely pleased with my draw-thru so I am anxious to compare the two.   In closing, I wanted to tell you again how much I have enjoyed your web site. 

Best wishes,

Roland                    Pictures:  1    2 3    4Hello Greg, Great web site!   Good information.    I too, have gotten bite by the "Dick Datson" bug.    Dick makes a very persuasive case for Turing "old" engines.   My project is a GEN 1 Rambler V-8, have picked 5 engines & 3 vehicles with Gen 1 engines.   I too intend to use Chrysler turbo's, have pulled several for the local pick-a-part.   It's nice to see you progressing with your Stude.   Good luck.Rodney 

 JUST GOT MY FIRST STUDE AND WAS LOOKING THRU SITES FOR IDEAS THAT DID NOT TAKE A BANKER TO FINANCE. I LIKE THE APPROACH YOU HAVE TAKEN,ITS IS SIMILAR TO WHAT I LIKED TO DO IN THE 60'S. MAKE SOMETHING OUT OF PARTS THAT YOU HAVE LAYING AROUND OR VAN BUY CHEAP FROM A SALVAGE YARD. I QUIT WORKING ON CARS25 YEARS AGO, BUT HAVE CAUGHT THE BUG AGAIN. I ALSO NOTICED THAT YOU HAVE A 53. ME TOO. I BOUGHT MINE BY ACCIDENT, I WENT TO BUY A CORVAIR AND THA GUY HAD A 53 COMMANDER COUPE. I DRUG BOTH HOME. THE STUDE HAS A NAILHEAD BUICK AND DYNAFLOW, BUT A FRIEND HAS A CADDY ENGINE AND TRANS. MY CAR WAS A 6VOLTPOS GROUND BUT THE BUICK IS A 12V NEG. THE CAR HAS 2 6V BATTERIES AND SOME TYPE OF WIERD(TO ME) WIRING. CAN YOU TELL ME WHAT YOU HAD TO DO ON YOUR 53 TO CONVERT IT TO 12V NEG GROUND?  GAUGES, BLOWER MOTOR, RADIO,, WIPERS, ETC. IS YOUR 53 A STICK SHIFT? IS YOUR TURBO BURNING RUBBER YET? A FRIEND OF MINE IS TRYING TO CONVINCE ME TO PUT A 6 IN MY 53, AS HE IS TIRED OF SMALL BLOCKJUNK TOO.   KEN 

Greg,

Read your aticle and have picked up three turbo units from the junk
yards. I have a 185 6 cyl, 1956 Flight Hawk with the T-96 and OD. Will
try and duplicate your efforts. What do you suggest on the trans. I have
failing synchos. Should I replace them  or can I switch to a T-86. Any
idea if that tranny will even mate up or work with the engine? What are
your thoughts on getting the #23 axle out and putting in a #27?

Have you driven your Stude yet? Drop me a line and I'll keep reading up
on these things. Will be working this weekend, but available during the
week. I currently own a 37 Business Coupe, a 1963 GT with 4 bbl, 4 speed
and full dash, and a 1963 Super Hawk(R2). My daughter has the FH and it
can not get out of its own way(suspect a worn clutch), as it has a 4.56
rear.

Dave 

 Hello Greg, Have been looking at your web page and must say that you have done a good   job. At the time I have a 1950 2 dr coupe Studebaker sitting in the shop and waiting to get the time to get it on the road as another street rod , I'm 62 yrs old but I dont let that hold me back. I have done many many street rods from cars to trucks .  here is a pic of my Stude that I havebought about a yr  ago.  Keep up the good work my friend   Larry here in Fla wpe1.jpg (101365 bytes)Love your site, cool car. also have some weird stuff. I drove a 51 Stude Pickup from 1979 to 1991.   Wore out the Flathead and two small block Fords.   Tore it down to rebuild it, then built wife's 48 Chevy and got orders for England.  Still have the truck in basket case form. Finally building a garage at my new house here in Colorado.  Threw together a 48 Nash 600 4 door in a few weeks for the Rocky Mtn Street Rod Nats.   Flathead with glass pack.   Had fun watching people say "what is that?"  -- "I don't know". Blue car provided engine for copper car.   Quick and dirty paint job,  97 Chrysler Malibu yellow with flattener.   Looks like Tweety Bird yellow primer. If I end up keeping the car (and parts car)  I'm thinking about an 8" rear, Mustang II IFS, some late model 4 speed (or 3 speed) and a bored, ported, relieved Nash flathead.   You might want to use some of that high temp coating on piston tops, head, and exhaust ports.     Might even use the second engine for a T-bucket. MJW

Truck.jpg 
nashfrnt.jpg 
 
Greg,


Thanks a ton for sending me the link to your website! I think it's great that
you're building up a Stude. I've got a part time job working as a parts guy at
Checker Auto (to pay bills while going to college) and all too often I hear,
"I've built the FASTEST smallblock Chevy! Got about $8000 in the engine
alone!" and then it turns out to be some clapped out Camaro with chrome valve
covers ) I've got an '84 AMC Eagle as a daily driver, which will probably get
a turbo as soon as I can rustle up some $, and a '74 Javelin AMX as a toy. I
love seeing Chevy and Ford guys jaws drop when the Javelin starts up. I've
done my research on AMCs and put the $ into where it pays off most. My
ultimate goal is to build up one of the two 401s I've got with a dual carb,
twin turbo, nitrous setup. Mind you, this is WAY down the road, but hey a guy
can dream can't he?) Once again Greg, thanks much I really appreciate you
responding. If I'm ever down around that way I'll drop you a line. 

Nathan


SalStude

Greg, You and I must have been separated at birth. I also have a flat 6 turbo 
in my driveway. Mine is in a 54 Cpe. If you are interested, I can send 
photos. I did mine a little different than you, but the concept is the same. 
I have had mine on the road a couple of times to work out the bugs, but have 
no performance data yet. So far, its building about 14 lbs of boost at 4000 
rpms, and the power increase is quite noticeable. At the time we were running 
through a 2.75 rear end, so now that it has a 3.25, it should be much better. 
Anyway, Dick published some photos of my intake and exhaust manifolds some 
time ago. Unfortunately, the project go shelved for quite a while as I 
started a new business. Now, its back on track and undergoing some changes, 
like, pressure box, internal regulator, higher pressure fuel pump, etc. Let 
me know if you would like to share info. Yours looks great. I am already 
jealous of your work space. I get a 10 x 5 foot space in the garage. Good 
luck on all you're doing. Sal

Greg, Sorry I cant help you with the solenoid problem. To be honest with you, 
my project is pretty much a slam bam kinda job. I am not concerning myself 
too much with looks right now. I am trying to just get the beast on the road 
to see how viable the turbo package is. I figure it should run pretty well, 
but you never know. When I had it on the road last time, it would build boost 
to 12 psi, but would run out of power due to lack of fuel. The first turbo I 
had on there was like the one you're using, from a Dodge 2.2. ( or 2.5 ), 
whatever. Anyway, it only produced 5-6 psi at 4000 rpms. But I think it was 
partly due to the turbo being a little "lazy". It didnt have quite the free 
spinning ability of the one I have now. Also, the turbo from the Audi 5000 
has the same size exhaust side with a slightly smaller compressor side. That 
seems to as much responsible for the increase in boost as the "newer" nature 
of the Audi. At any rate, it will hopefully be put back together in the next 
couple weeks. When I get some data and a seat of the pants report, I'll give 
you a full update. I'm thinking of taking it to the drag strip to see exactly 
what sort of times it will do in the 1/8 th and 1/4 mile. That is where I'll 
learn more than anything, I think. And if it blows up, then I will have lost 
some time, but only about $2-300 in investment. Not bad for all the fun its 
been. I still get a kick out of telling people what I'm doing with the car. 
The shocked look on their faces is always worth it. Sounds like youve been 
getting the same sort of responses as I have. Its fun, eh? I love to tweak 
the purists. Its also fun to imagine how much power potential there is in 
package. If it does work as we hope....We may put Cathcart out of business. 
LOL  My opinion on the OD is to leave it for later. You wont need it till you 
know if you can drive it that fast anyway. You will certainly have some bugs 
to work out of the system as you go along, so anything you can do to expedite 
the first drive, the better. That is going to be the best indicator of what 
needs to be done versus what you want done. Then you can make a punch list of 
fine tuning the subsystems till you get the desired results. Remember, my 
opinion is worth what you paid for it......nothing. Good luck on the work, I 
hope it goes well and smoothly for you. I'll be happy to pass on any 
successes or failures to you. Anything to save a step. More later, Sal

The flat 6 turbo lives again. This is a Stude 169 cu in flat head 6 
with an Audi 5000 turbo mounted directly to the exhaust manifold. 
Some recent changes to the car are: a pressure box for the carb, 
holley blue fuel pump, Hurst shifter for the 3 spd trans,fuel 
pressure gage and boost gage. A pressure box holds the AFB carb and 
the fuel pressure regulator. This was done to test the regulator in 
the box. It works well. The pump is preset to 19 lbs and the 
regulator is preset to 6 lbs. With the regulator in the box fuel is 
always delivered 6 lbs above whatever pressure is in the box. Boost 
comes on at about 2000 rpms, builds quickly to 4 lbs and climbs 
steadily to 12 lbs at 4500 rpms. The engine felt as though it could 
keep the power building, but the engine was a freebie and its 
condition is unknown, so.....we took it easy. Only 75 mph for this 
trip. Next time were going to go to 5500 rpms and maybe try 6000. I 
only hope the clutch can handle it. The Hurst shifter was a great 
blessing. The last time it had a junk shifter and we lost all the 
rpms (and power) between shifts. Not today!!! Great drive. Still has 
a few glitches to work out. Fast idle for one. Were chasing down a 
vacuum leak. Also, the clutch linkage needs a little fix. Nothing big 
though. It feels like a small V8 power wise, but the power comes on 
at the higher end instead of the low end as the Studie V8s do. More 
later as things progress. Oh, by the way, total price for the project 
so far...$185. Good fun for cheap, eh? Sal
 

 
Greg,


The AFB is a standard Carter variety 4 bbl. I plugged all the vent holes per 
a worksheet I got from Dick Datson. It still has the original brass floats 
and so far they have not collapsed. 
The regulator came with the blue Holley pump. I put it in the box just cuz I 
wanted to see how it would work. It did great. the pressure goes up with the 
boost just as it should. No more fuel starving at the high end. As Ted said, 
it would work just as well, if not better if you pressurized it with out a 
box.
I am not using vacuum advance. I just set the timing advanced a bit, ( I did 
not measure ) just by advancing the timing as far as I thought it would take 
it while idleing at 2500 rpms. Seems to work OK for now. 
By the way, the box is just a wood box with a plywood lid that I threw 
together just to see if it would work. I will probably switch back to a 
bonnet in the next week or so. the box is a pain in the neck. 
It makes good power even past the 5500 rpm mark. The next change is to get 
smaller gears in the rear end. I have 3.25s in there now and its just too 
stinkin tall. Bogs in first. I am looking for a 4.11 or 4.56 for a Ford 9". I 
think that will be ideal. These little 6s need all the gear they can get to 
get off the line. After that it would take off on the turbo. 
More later...Sal

 
Greg, How ya doin? I finally got my turbo back on the road. Wow, what a 


difference. Now using the Audi 5000 turbo and it made a big improvement in 
the spool up. Now power comes on at about 2000 rpms and builds to 12 lbs at 
4500. Power keeps coming, but the engine was a freebie and I dont know the 
condition. Also, I got a Hurst shifter installed and that also made a big 
difference. I used to lose the boost and the power between shifts, cuz the 
shift was so slow. Not anymore. Also I'm now using the Holley blue fuel pump 
so Im not starving for fuel anymore. The power is great to 75 mph. Thats as 
fast as I wanted to go for the first try. We're still working out a couple of 
glitches, tho. High idle for one. We have a vacuum leak somewhere. Also, the 
clutch linkage needs to be radically adjusted. The shaft keeps slipping out 
of the socket. No, I'm not getting personal. Anyway, I haven't seen any new 
info on your little project, so I thought I would send some of my news. Sal

 
Flathead 6 turbo...good-bye for now     (from the Blowthru list)

 
 
 
 
 
 
 

We took the 169 inch flathead 6 turbo out for one more run before we 
pulled it out of the 54 Coupe. We ran it up to 110 mph and outran my 
son's Chevy S-10 which has a 350 in it. That was satisfying. The 
whole project was done just for the fun of it while the car was in 
hibernation anyway, so we had the fun we wanted. We never planned to 
run it with the 6 for long. (Even tho the turbo's been in there for 
over 3 years now.) But now work is finally giving me time to play 
with the car a bit more now. The turbo 6 really gave me time to work 
out fuel systems and carb sealing, and besides, we found out that a 
little 169 flat 6 of 1939 design and a whopping $250 of used turbo 
and hardware store parts will make an old motor go pretty well. Too 
bad the little clutch wasn't just a bit stronger. It sorta gave up 
the ghost in the last outing. I guess it wasn't intended to handle 
6000 rpms under 15# of boost, eh? Oh, well, the 232 will have a 10 
1/2 inch hi-perf clutch, 1/2 inch fuel line, fuel cell, new carb, and 
we decided to break the bank and spend $25 MORE dollars on all new 
plumbing for the turbo. We will spare no expense to make this turbo 
run the doors off its competitors, even if we have to spend 50 
dollars. Thanks, Dick for all the help and support through the years. 
We could not have done any of it without your work on the 
newsletters. Sal

 
Greg,


Thanks for the note on the passing (maybe more later?) of the flat 6 turbo. 
It sure was fun while it lasted. I will try to get some photos together and 
send them to you. The 6 is already out of the car. I will take some shots of 
the engine and turbo setup before we dismantle it. 
We took the low-buck approach to the car. No wastegate, no blow-off, no 
pressure regulation of any kind. Mine didn't even have a flapper valve. The 
turbo blew into the carb and we watched the pressure gage and the tach at the 
same time, sort of. Sometimes it was all we could do to just watch the road. 
110 mph is pretty fast while we're wondering about whether the clutch is 
going to blow up at any time... Great fun, eh? I am thinking about the 
possibility of running a much lightened Lark with the turbo 6 in it someday. 
If I could get the car down to 2500 lbs, that would be a gas. It would really 
need 4:11 gears minimum to make it launch tho. 
Have you had yours out on the road lately? How does it run? I would be glad 
to hear about it, or share any of my vast turbo knowledge with you, LOL. 
Later, Sal


Greg,


Welcome Greg. You're doing a great job getting the word out on your little 
Stude 6. I've seen a real leap in interest in turbocharging little inline 
sixes of all kinds in recent months and I hope this continues. Who knows, 
maybe we'll see an old turbo six running in SCCA or Rallying, etc.  Keep us 
updated on your progress.  Dick 
I'm relieved that the oil pressure thing has gone well. This has to be the 
only real weakness of the engine. I'm old enough to remember when the small 
main bearing flatheads raced in midgets. In fact, the first real car race I 
ever saw was a midget race with a Stude Champion running against the popular 
Ford 60's. Even in 1948 they were turning 7000 -- because they bragged about 
it! So we know it can go -- its just keeping it together that's the question. 
You're off to a good start -- looking forward to a long, successful drive. 
Dick

Greg, 

 
 
 
 
 
 
 

Took a few pictures of your site. Great site and very informative. Only 
problem I see--your carbusretor is only half the size it should be. No 
problem for everyday driving but if you ever get the urge to run Bonneville 
you should plan on at least a 400 cfm 4bbl. (No, I'm not kidding). Using 
Ted's car as a gauge, do you realize that you should have about 600cfm. (More 
than half of the 1200 cfm Ted uses on 300 cu.in.)  Actually a 350 Holley 2bbl 
would probably be easy to fit your manifold. 

I'll have to cut the dark background from the pictures of your complete turbo 
and manifold setup. If you ever get a chance, send me a nice photo I can use 
for a cover. You can just take it off your own site-- you surely have a 
quality color printer. I use black and white for the dozens of things I print 
daily -- mostly print, so quality isn't that good at my end. You've got great 
photos though.

Dick


I found your site and really enjoyed it! I plan on adapting a turbo to my T Cab when I get it back together. I am in the process of re-assembling it now. It was a basket case when I purchased it, so it has been a slow go.                        Thanks, Kerry

  Greg
   My name is Bill  in Carlisle Pa. and I just found your web site last 
night and it
blew my mine. I am a 50+ year old, junk yard hot rodder who is the proud 
owner of a
1949 star light coupe. I bought the Stude cp after I sold my 1947 Ford 
business cp that I built over 10 yrs in my back yard. I have been torn 
between keeping it stock or
modifying it.Your turbo idea sound like the cats ass. As I like your self, 
like to be different and to screw with peoples minds. I did build my ford 
with chevy running gear
only because it was the cheapest way to go,but I ketp the stock front end and 
put on
disc breaks. I also added power steering by using a chevy 605 box and 
inverted the
pitman arm, and if you read all the hot rod books this was not possable 
unless I sent
the arm to Ca. to have it bent a special way. So if you don't know any better 
you just
make things work. 
        Now for my questions (1st) what year mustang II rear did you use and 
did it bolt
right to the studes springs or were they the mustangs springs?
   (2) My car is 6 volt positive ground, what do I have to do to change to 12 
volt neg ground and what about the amp gage, gas gage, and fan motors?
   (3)On your turbo setup do you need a computer for the oxygen sensors and 
if not
how do you control them?
    I am waiting to hear the answers to the question you asked. about 
carburetor etc.
also where did you get the premium valves and springs? There is so much I 
want to 
ask you when you prove things out and I am working on a shoe string budet. 
Because when I turned 50 I was out of a job and now trying to start over 
again at a lot 
less pay, but that my problem. But if you can help out with common sense 
building
I would be greatly appreciated because all the magazines do is cater to the 
BIG BUCKS GUYS.

     Thanks  Bill 


Greg,                                                                                     2/7/01

Glad I found your site for a couple of reasons. I'm an old hot rodder whose 
been playing with forced induction for 25 years. Good to see you progress on 
the flatty turbo. I started out doing turbo installs and later played with 
both centrifugal and roots type superchargers.

About a dozen years ago I bought my first Caddy 500 and shoehorned it and a
GM 425 Turbo Hydro into a downsized Toronado. That was my daily driver for 
many years. Now on to the current project -- the one where I need your help. 
I've put some money down on a 1950 Four door Studebaker. The original six 
is still in place but my measuring stick says the Caddy 500 will fit. First 
question: Do you agree? Secondly, what is the weight of the stock engine and 
what is the weight of a stock version of the Studebaker?

Looking for somebody who knows both the engine and the car. You seem to be 
the man.

Thanks in advance,

Darius 

Thanks for the prompt reply.

I can understand having too many projects and not having too much time. That 
Turbo-Stude sounds like my kind of project. I started out in the 70's doing 
Corvair powered dune buggies and street cars. I ran a max of 22lbs of boost 
on the street. The engines held up extremely well considering that the first 
ones I modified were running stock cast pistons. Forged pistons got the 
chance later. The problem was with engine cooling, which on an air cooled 
engine is marginal to begin with.

Had some fun with GM straight six-292s and your typical small blocks. Played 
with some Mopar small blocks as well. Anyway, it was all good. It sure is 
easy to get addicted to that push in the back which seems to never end. LOVE 
THE RUSH!

Thanks for the numbers on the Caddy 500. The one I built and put into the 
mid-sized Toronado was a 30-over bore, with a custom cam giving about .520 
@.050 and 228 degrees on the intake and 230 on the exhaust. On the bench the 
intake flowed really well with mild pocket porting but the exhaust side 
didn't wake up until going to a larger valve. I ran a stock Q-Jet, on a 
stock intake, with stock exhausts. That somewhat limited the benefits of the 
head work.

I am rebuilding that engine with a different cam, Sanderson headers, 
Edelbrock intake and aftermarket FUEL INJECTION. I do have a stock Cadillac 
F.I. for the 500 but it is under-slung, just like the standard carb 
manifolds. Not sure if I'll freshen the same late-model, large-chamber heads 
or have a set of the early heads done. It depends on the compression ratio 
available with a set of custom forged pistons. I do want more squeeze.

I am grateful for the information you provided but am still wondering about 
the weight of the Studebaker Flat Six, and of the Champion. Do you have any 
number?

As far as suspension and brakes go, the stock units, front and rear, will be 
replaced. Trying to get an idea of weight to determine if the package is 
sufficiently "light" to allow the additional weight of an all-wheel drive out 
of an Astro/Safari van. I too am comcered about hooking up. 

By the way, my business involves a new supercharger with a unique design.
Maybe after you get the Stude sorted out you might was to become a beta 
tester?

Darius

Love that low weight number. It leave me room to work. I'll call on the 
engine weights. Thanks for the help and yes, feel free to post it cause I 
probably qualify as a nut.

Darius


Greg,

I was looking at what you're doing with the intake manifold and  it looks very interesting.  I am fairly familiar with this type of setup through my job.  I am contracted to Ford SVT and we have used various designs of this in most of our cars.  However it has been my experience that with forced induction a runner configuration like that is not necessary.  With a turbo or supercharger the boost makes up for the lost torque at the low end assuming it spools up quickly.  Let me give some examples:1996-1998 Cobra 4.6l motor had what we call intake manifold runner control (imrc).  This was a plate that uncovered the second runner to each port.  The primary runner was short and improved low end torque then at about 3500rpm the second would open and give you a little kick in the pants.  In '99 team Mustang engineered that out and went to larger intake ports with a completely different manifold the result was that the car picked up peak horsepower and torque but lost the midrange surge.  The car felt like it had no torque.  However tuners are getting much better power numbers with blowers on the '99's than any previous year.  As for boost our lightning has 300lbs/ft of torque at 1000rpm.  That's plenty of low end without any special intake.  In another exaple we have developed a new type of variable length runner that is a true variable length runner for the upcoming svt focus.  It is similar to what you're doing and it creates a very flat torque curve through its tuning.  This is a 4 banger that gets 85% of its torque at 2200rpm and continues to pull to 7000.  This is because of the variable runner length.  It works great and really makes the car feel faster than it is.  However if it had a turbo I doubt we'd do that. Well I don't mean to discourage your manifold design but I'm not sure it's ideal for the turbo.  I'd sooner tune the motor with a smaller turbo.  Sticking with the variable runner length I might design a manifold for the inline motor that had two runners to each port and make one shorter than the other with the longer one having a butterfly.  It would be pretty easy (easier said than done huh)to do this with steel tubing.  I can think of some possibilities for sure.  Well I wish you luck and if you want to bounce any ideas I'd be happy to converse to the best of my ability.  For the record I'm not an engineer though I am pretty technical and I work with engineers on all this stuff.    Take care,-Jesse 


I'm sure you get plenty of e-mail from all over, so you probably don't remember me.  I e-mailed you a couple of times and played (unsuccessful) phone tag with you.  I'm the guy in Lakeville building a 51 Stude with the original champ engine. I just wanted to say the photos of the car look great.  I didn't get a chance to see you at Back to the 50's because I got called out of bed Sat night for work and couldn't drag my butt out of bed on Sunday to make the show.  I guess I should have gone earlier in the week instead of waiting till the swap meet.  Oh well. Just wanted to say that the pics look great and I look forward to seeing you and turbo Stude at Red Wing. PS.  A buddy of mine talked your ear off at Back to the 50s, then came back and told me all about your car.  Pretty good considering he is a die hard Chev fan.  Keep up the good work.Dan

Rick M sends  kudos and describes his very hot 53' Lincoln

 Dear Greg, I found your site today and quickly scanned it with great interest, as I recently bought a project car from the McDonald auction in Yakima, Wa. Picked up a virtually rust-free (as far as Studebakers go) little 59 lark 2 door sedan with a champ 6 in it, and pretty much decided to put the body on a stude v-8 frame, so as to go faster; and then your article came out of the computer and bit me....looks like this turbo idea would be a lot more fun, not to mention confounding the "me too! me too! "350/350 boys... I'll read your article in its entirety to see how you did it- Thanks for the great idea-be talking to you soon, Larry

 I have occasionally looked on your site to see your progress on the turbo project.  I was to the back to the 50's last year but did not see your car. Didn't go this year as I have been too busy trying to get my '53 hardtop painted...  I am planning to have my project in a unfinished state at redwing so we could "gross out" the purists together, hehe.  I have a 3.8 ford v6 in it (not yet running).  Too bad its not the super coupe version... The rest of the car is going to be stock in appearance.  I do have a interest in turbos as my winter beater is a rusty '85 t-bird turbo coupe. If I started over on my project or ever do another one, I might do something like you did and keep the flathead 6 in there.  Maybe with EFI and a turbo, and a T5 or something...

Good site, thanks!

Jeff 

 Hi Greg:  Enjoyed your site and purest type hotrod ethics.  It brought back fond memories of the 1960's when my brother and I built up a 1950 Stude 2 door coupe hot rod using the a Stude flathead six.  Some of my memories of 35 years ago are a little fuzzy now but as I recall we used an engine from a '58 Stude Scotsman station wagon because it had a little longer stroke and a few more cubic inches. We installed an Offenhouser multiple carb. manifold from Clifford research and development, 6=8, company.  The reground cam was a Weber.  I think we used a 170 head because the chambers were smaller but the premium gas back then was like aviation gas and it was almost impossible to make anything ping on it.  We changed out the rear and went to a really low ratio with mag wheels, raised the back end and installed a floor shift.  We had a custom blue paint job and a hood scoop installed to one side where the carbs were.  And yes, we cut a real hole thru the hood for the air intake under the scoop.  It used to give the stock '55, '56 and '57 alternate stock brands which were as common back then as fly poop on paint a real run.Try TRW or Sealed Power brand bearings.  They are a little harder and might hold up better.  I think that is what we used but then they might not make them for this old engine any more.  Back then, parts were real common.  Make sure that your oil pump is right up to specs and pumping max flow and pressure. Check the relief valve spring and maybe increase it a little.I wish I had a pic to send you of that old car but we sold it years ago.Happy Stude rodding:  Norm 
 
 

An incredible site!  I absolutely love the way you're putting this 
together, low-buck, trial and error...just my style!  It's great that you 
haven't been discouraged by those that suggest the fast, expensive and 
un-original way to do things. I will check back often to see your trials 
and tribulations!   I'm in the middle of a similar project, though much 
simpler with easier to obtain components. I'm building a 2.3 liter Ford 
with blow-through turbo on my Mustang II.  I won't listen to the typical 
response: "just buy a late model 2.3 with EFI already set-up with a turbo 
and a computer"  My response..."I don't like computers in cars and I love 
the challenge", The most fun is trying to figure out how to do it, find a 
part that might work, and building a way to put it on.

My system is a little more modern...kind of early 70's (that's retro to the 
kids these days)

78 2.3 Ford
Garrett Turbo from a turbo coupe
Intercooler from same
Holley- Weber 5200 carb
electric fuel pump flowing through a Cagle regulator (lucked out finding 
this as it has a fitting to reference boost pressure)
half of a late model intake with a homemade carb adapter plate
started working on the bonnet until I fund someone that would sell me one 
ready made for cheap
found a by-pass valve that I'll mount before the carb to bleed of pressure 
when I let off the gas (keeps the turbo spooled up and stops surge).

Anyway, enough about me....continued luck with your project, it looks like 
great fun!

P.S. the photo of the carb plate with tubes looks like a carb adapter that 
was sold by Turbo City for draw-through applications.

Kind regards,

FrancisTed Harbit put me onto your website, since my '51 Champ coupe can be embarrassingly wimpy climbing local hills in traffic...even after I rebuilt her.  Greg, I'm really impressed with what you've accomplished and have to think the old Studebaker engineers, long in their graves, would be proud of you, man.  You're an innovator.  I met Bill Cathcart last summer, when in CT visiting my daughter, and had a great time with another guy who uses new things with the 'tired-iron' from bygone days and finds the marriage works. I spent over two hours at your website this morning and realized how little I know about the dynamics of the internal (infernal?) combustion engine...trying to grasp what you've done.  Wish I lived closer to you, to be your wrench-gopher and learn something!  (I was born in IA, but parents grew weary of the cold and we moved to FL years ago.) Thank you for taking the time to chronicle your work and photograph stuff as you went along.  You're right about restoration and rodding being projects that are never finished.  When you have a sec, check out my site for 'Cheeks' and please, don't laugh too much.  :-)   God bless and thanks again!

I hope I have e-mailed the right guy. If not-please direct me to the correct
party.  I was reading the story about the Turbo-Flathead six. Strangely enough, I am
considering a very similar project. I am in process of restoring a 1948
Chrylser Windsor Sedan with a 205 CID flathead six. The engine's stock output
is a less than inspirational 100 HP though it does have impressive torque.
Still with a 3800+ pound car I wanted to bump out the power. had considered a
late model engine swap but decided that there would be nothing "special"
about an old car with a modern engine
(anybody can do that). I decided that a turbo upgrade would make the old wagon that much more "unusual".  Having a Turbo LeBaron of my own for the past 260,000 miles I had a lot of respect for that turbo package.

The "48" Sedan has more than enough room under the hood for the turbo and
associated plumbing. Somehow, I stumble onto your website with your turbo conversion and I was pretty impressed. I would like to get the story on hard copy and steady the
details.
We should keep in touch.
Regards,
Al 


 

Digger Dave

Digger Dave is a kindred spirit from Indiana whom I met while attending the Michiana Chapter Studebaker driver's club swap meet. He is a long time racer and gearhead who is building a Stude pickup with a 170 cubic inch flathead motor. It will be a draw-thru type with a rootes style blower. It has special valves, cam and headers. Watch here in coming months for more about his build-up.

7/29/02: Hi Greg, Thought I would send some specs of my Super Champ engine. Bore 3.040" Stroke 4.375" Cubic inches 190.5".Intake Valves 1.500"cut down from 1.600"Chrysler 2.2/2.5 Turbo . Reprofiled stock exhaust valves 1.281" . I ported & polished the block myself . Stock cam regrind by Isky Cams 220degrees@.050" lift .Total lift .312" .Compression ratio 7.6 to 1 with stock head . By the way ,the bore & hone with block plate and 3 angle valve job was performed by Shaker Racing of Granger, Indiana. Now for the good stuff .Mercedes Supercharger by Eaton 91cu.in. Jaguar Stromberg sidedraft carb. Cut down Offy intake manifold. Homemade supercharger mount , intake plenum , belt drive and tubing headers. My ignition started with a 292 "chevy HEI 6cylinder distributor with Olds advance mechanism and shaft grafted to a Studebaker shaft. The subject of the oil pump, I am working my own design using a gear- rotor type impellor . Not completed. digger dave
 Motor-side view
 Motor-front view
 Exhaust

Hello Greg:
You have created a very clever and informative site! Congratulations and
best wishes for the future.
When I read about the stuff you've done with an old Stude I thought to
myself, "there's someone else out there a little more weird than me!" Nice
project.
My project is an '83 Volvo that had a B23 engine. I turbo'd it. The shop
where I buy parts sells Federal-Mogul and they don't supply oversized
pistons for Volvo B23 for some reason. Volvo does, at cubic dollars a shot.
Buick pistons fit with a 0.020" overbore. I've done other mods and it ran
fairly well though I only put about 325 miles on it. A cloud of steam
followed me home last week. Problem: the B23 engine that was supposed to be
in the car was in fact a B21, bored out to B23 specs. Number 3 cylinder
developed a crack, hence the cloud of steam. I don't know what I'm going to
do just yet so I decided to read some more of your exploits to gain some
confidence to continue on.
Thanks for the informative and entertaining WEB site, Greg. Well done
Bill


HEY DAD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
This is ur daughter speaking. i just wanted 2 let u know that ur sight is pretty cool!!!!!!!!!!!! And to those who are reading this... im not just saying this site is cool because im his daughter. OH< and b4 i 4get to tell u, since this is the only way we communicate i would like to tell u that Mom is on the phone... she's calling from target and was wondering what color u wanted those new shorts. anyways...
love ur lovely daughter



 

Greg: The turbo-six you are building brings back a lot of great memories. I built and ran sand/dirt dragsters back in the late 70's to mid 80's. Ford 300 six was my engine of choice. When I started, I got a lot of info and help from Ak Miller. After about 6 years I had other racers calling me for help.
At the peak we had the car running 20 lbs. of boast and pulling about 600 H.P. This was with the block and head o-ringed, studded, and using a copper head gasket. Before we got to that point we destroyed a few heads and melted the walls of the block between the pistons a few times. It was worth it to beat the small blocks. We won over a hundred races and retired the car (1974 Bronco) in 1986. I got out of the racing business and into streetrods. I now have a 1934 Plymouth coupe with (man I hate to say this) a ZZ4 small block Chevy. If I can be of any help let me know. Keep up the good work. Regards,
Steve


Greg, A great website and car. You have inspired me to build another turbo six. Several years ago I built an AMC 258 for my 65 American, now 401 powered. It was bored .060 stock pistons, first mistake. Had a comp. cams camshaft and off 4 barrel manifold. Trans was a converted jeep turbo400 and a mopar 8.75 axle with 3.23 gears. Used a buick regal turbo. the older carb models. Bolted to the intake with a aluminum adapter. Ran the exhaust to the turbo from the stock exh manifold with U pipes. Used a S+S Super G carb made for a Harley. Had to use a fuel pressure regulator to limit fuel pressure to 1 pound for the carb. Used a 3# hobbs switch to 2 relays to energise a windshield washer pump and reservoir for water injection, also a Jacobs boost retard ignition. Lots of work to get the trans to shift properly, vacuum modulator would not shift under boost. Raced car at Gateway near St louis for 3 years with the 6. Ran a best of 14.2 in 1/4 mile. In drive, street tires. Broke pistons 4 times. Would blow rings down over wrist pin. Was a great street car. Would detonate at the drags in the traps. After swapping in the 401 traced problem to a too small fuel line. Stumped me for 3 years. I have one polaroid picture of engine I will send if I can find it. Getting old and can’t find things. I just bought a 60 Rambler American 2 door wagon. Was going to swap in the now non turbo 258, but now I think I will rebuild the flathead 196. Your Quadrajet intake is from a turbo trans am. Sold one on ebay last year. Buick uses 2 and 4 barrel ones that were smaller.

Keep up good work. Mike


Hi Greg - I cannot but marvel at the time and effort
you have put into the documentation of your project -
the project speaks for itself, but being of mechanical
bent, that I understand - the idea of taking time to
wash ones hands to take pictures and write up the
trials and tribulations is what is uncomprehensible to
me. I take it that you're going to Bonneville this
fall?

Your observations on the bearing areas etc. of the 3 X
4 engine are noted, so it would seem the bottom end is
not a pressing problem, if the revs are kept in check,
or even, if they go somewhat into orbit (7 grand, but
I'll bet the OHV won't get to those revs). How have
you found the head sealing to hold up? When we built
up the OHV engine, we searched through quite a few
junk yards to find an uncracked head, but over 100,000
miles later, it seems to be fine. That's why my feel
is that it is overheating that causes the demise.

Like you, our biggest problem has been with the
overdrive unit, followed by the gearbox, followed by
the rear end. Engine oil leaks - I tell my son, the
car's owner, that if it doesn't leak, don't drive -
it's out of oil!

I guess I should give you some history - when my son
was approaching 16, we found a '53 Packard Panama in
sorry shape, but complete, which we got running and he
used for school and all the other things teens use a
car for - however, it became apparent that it was
eating him out of house and home with the appetite for
fuel, tires, spares, etc. So we started looking for a
Starlight Coupe since I knew that would be less
expensive to run, and it would be "cool" for a
teenager - we found a '51 Champ 4 door behind a barn
here in the Central Valley of California which had
minimal rust - even here they rust, let me tell you!
It had a broken front brake drum, that's why it had
been parked, but otherwise was complete and running.
Not a Starlight, but.. Anyway, he ran it for a while,
but the engine was burning oil and not too happy, so
we decided to rebuild it. We ran across a '63 engine
out of a station wagon in a junk yard which seemed a
better candidate for rebuild than the original - it
dropped right in with only minor massaging of the fire
wall - about three well aimed blows with a heavy
hammer! We also took the front brakes and eventually
the gear box, O/D and rear from the same donor. We're
still running 6 volts, more from inertia than anything
else.

Rob used it through college, his first two or three
jobs as his everyday go to work car - his wife
naturally drove the "good" car, and now it is sort of
a Sunday go to car shows and drive the kids around
car. So 20 some years later it is a member of the
family and likely to stay that way, but maybe it could
use a little more power and an A/C unit??

Going through your site, I got interested in the
"wirbel" deal - it put me in mind of hearing some
testing done on hydrogen peroxide engines at the Navy
Test Station at Annapolis MD in the early '50s - the
noise was excruciating, and "odd" at the same time -
was there any "wirbel" tech used in those? And what
are you using it for? It occurs to me that you could
get very cold (dense) air out of one side of this
gimmick - what you would do with the hot other side I
don't know. But you sure wouldn't need an
intercooler!

I must admit to being an apostate - I'm into Hudsons
and Cadillacs, but I will still speak to Studebaker
drivers as almost equals - I'll admit to owning a '37
President, a '55 President Coupe (I bought it new,
couldn't quite swing a Speedster) and a '63 Lark
"Ladies Special" which was sort of a pink color and
the glove box was a makeup kit with mirror and all -
gave $ 50.- for it running - nobody else would have
it!

If you know of anyone who has worked a OHV engine, I'd
appreciate the info. In the meantime, best of fortune
on the "little six flathead" - I'll keep watching your
web site, and who knows, I might just make it to
Bonneville!

Best regards, B